Cyber Knight Info?

[Lenwen]

One of my players has decided to play a cyber knight. While I am somewhat familiar with the OCC, the only book other then the core book I can think of to have a bulk of information on them is the CS Tolkeen war book.

I was curious as to if there is a noticeable amount of information on the cyber knights in any other books other then those two. If someone can point me in the right direction I can start trying to filter through them.

Rifts Ultimate Edition.

[Mack]

One of my players has decided to play a cyber knight. While I am somewhat familiar with the OCC, the only book other then the core book I can think of to have a bulk of information on them is the CS Tolkeen war book.

I was curious as to if there is a noticeable amount of information on the cyber knights in any other books other then those two. If someone can point me in the right direction I can start trying to filter through them.

The original version is in the original Rifts, of course.
They were updated in Siege on Tolkeen 4 with new abilities.
And then there's some minor tweaks as of Rifts Ultimate Edition.

[Crucible]

Lord Coake, I personally would like you (I assume you're a fan of the CK) to tell me what makes the Cyber-Knight so great. Even in RUE its only okay. Was excied to buy the Cyber-Knight Sourcebook and was a little let down. I haven't paid attention to the tweaks in RUE as opposed to the SoT/CK book, so what was the tweak? The Psi-Sword is great if you're in a SDC town, but pull that thing out against a fully armored CS Grunt if you want to.

[Mack]

Also, don't underestimate the CK's ability to duel weild a pair of Psi-Swords at level three. That effectively doubles his attacks per rounds.

[Crucible]

Lord Coake, I personally would like you (I assume you're a fan of the CK) to tell me what makes the Cyber-Knight so great. Even in RUE its only okay. Was excied to buy the Cyber-Knight Sourcebook and was a little let down. I haven't paid attention to the tweaks in RUE as opposed to the SoT/CK book, so what was the tweak? The Psi-Sword is great if you're in a SDC town, but pull that thing out against a fully armored CS Grunt if you want to.

The Psi-sword is a great weapon if used propperlly, just besause it says sword in the title dosn't mean it has to be a sword, being able to change the shape and type of weapon you are using in combat by a mere thought has an insane amount of uses, and is a great advantage to any PC or NPC, and it should be taken advantage of.

Isn't it so that once you choose the shape, it has to stay that particular shape?

Mack
Thats pretty cool, but what about a Psi-Staker who can use to Vibro-Swords at a time?

[Crucible]

Lord Coake, I personally would like you (I assume you're a fan of the CK) to tell me what makes the Cyber-Knight so great. Even in RUE its only okay. Was excied to buy the Cyber-Knight Sourcebook and was a little let down. I haven't paid attention to the tweaks in RUE as opposed to the SoT/CK book, so what was the tweak? The Psi-Sword is great if you're in a SDC town, but pull that thing out against a fully armored CS Grunt if you want to.

The Psi-sword is a great weapon if used propperlly, just besause it says sword in the title dosn't mean it has to be a sword, being able to change the shape and type of weapon you are using in combat by a mere thought has an insane amount of uses, and is a great advantage to any PC or NPC, and it should be taken advantage of.

Isn't it so that once you choose the shape, it has to stay that particular shape?

Mack
Thats pretty cool, but what about a Psi-Staker who can use to Vibro-Swords at a time?

NO' you can change the shape at any time, it takes one attack IIRC. So if your opponent moves out of range of your sword you change it to a pole-arm, he tackles you and your on the ground change it to a knife. Psi-Swords are really cool now, aren't they.

Whatchoo lookin at? Ain't nuthin to see over here! What's that in my mouf? Nuthin! Ain't choo eva seent a foot in sumboddies mouf?

LOL!!! The last guy to use a Cyber Knight IG was back in the Old Rifts Book. I've only used them briefly as PC's or every now and again someone will choose the OCC and never even use anything Cyber Knight-ish...LOL.

[Mack]

Mack
Thats pretty cool, but what about a Psi-Staker who can use to Vibro-Swords at a time?

What of it? All Men-at-Arms classes can take WP Paired Weapons, but the CK gets it automatically, plus some other nifty advantages (not counting the anti-Tech ones).

The Psi-Stalker would have to invest in WP Paired Weapons, and the Cyber-Knight has the initial advantage in that both Psi-Swords can be summoned without using his attacks.

[Crucible]

Mack
Thats pretty cool, but what about a Psi-Staker who can use to Vibro-Swords at a time?

What of it? All Men-at-Arms classes can take WP Paired Weapons, but the CK gets it automatically, plus some other nifty advantages (not counting the anti-Tech ones).

The Psi-Stalker would have to invest in WP Paired Weapons, and the Cyber-Knight has the initial advantage in that both Psi-Swords can be summoned without using his attacks.

I get your point, but what about ambidextrous...that counts.

[Crucible]

Never had a GB or crazy either. We often forget when a guy is playing a CK that he is a CK.

[Crucible]

Mack
Thats pretty cool, but what about a Psi-Staker who can use to Vibro-Swords at a time?

What of it? All Men-at-Arms classes can take WP Paired Weapons, but the CK gets it automatically, plus some other nifty advantages (not counting the anti-Tech ones).

The Psi-Stalker would have to invest in WP Paired Weapons, and the Cyber-Knight has the initial advantage in that both Psi-Swords can be summoned without using his attacks.

I get your point, but what about ambidextrous...that counts.

I do believe that if a charactor is ambidextrous he has PW automaticlly.

Its cool though, I'll just have to READ a bit more...I only have the orginal Rifts in my head.

[Shark_Force]

RUE cyber-knight is pretty good. they get a ton of skills, good combat ability, can still use whatever guns/etc they get, have a decent weapon with infinite ammo, and a couple of psionic powers even if they aren't psionic (yeah, i dunno how to explain that one).

they're a pretty solid OCC nowadays.

[Lenwen]

RUE cyber-knight is pretty good. they get a couple of psionic powers even if they aren't psionic (yeah, i dunno how to explain that one).

[Novastar]

I'd say the original RMB Cyber-knight was more powerful than the current one, if you base it upon what's written in the book.

Yes, the RUE made them anti-tech supermen. But they've always had a ton of solid skills, and an energy sword you can summon at will is a really powerful advantage. And in the RMB, 2d6 MD for a melee weapon was pretty dern good (again, at no cost).

[Shark_Force]

I'd say the original RMB Cyber-knight was more powerful than the current one, if you base it upon what's written in the book.

Yes, the RUE made them anti-tech supermen. But they've always had a ton of solid skills, and an energy sword you can summon at will is a really powerful advantage. And in the RMB, 2d6 MD for a melee weapon was pretty dern good (again, at no cost).

ummm... did you notice the automatic dodge that the new cyberknight can get, by any chance?

[Crucible]

I'd say the original RMB Cyber-knight was more powerful than the current one, if you base it upon what's written in the book.

Yes, the RUE made them anti-tech supermen. But they've always had a ton of solid skills, and an energy sword you can summon at will is a really powerful advantage. And in the RMB, 2d6 MD for a melee weapon was pretty dern good (again, at no cost).

You can still get a 2d6MD melee weapon. Vibro Sword.

[Novastar]

I'd say the original RMB Cyber-knight was more powerful than the current one, if you base it upon what's written in the book.

Yes, the RUE made them anti-tech supermen. But they've always had a ton of solid skills, and an energy sword you can summon at will is a really powerful advantage. And in the RMB, 2d6 MD for a melee weapon was pretty dern good (again, at no cost).

ummm... did you notice the automatic dodge that the new cyberknight can get, by any chance?

Hence the "anti-tech superman" comment.

I'd say the original RMB Cyber-knight was more powerful than the current one, if you base it upon what's written in the book.

Yes, the RUE made them anti-tech supermen. But they've always had a ton of solid skills, and an energy sword you can summon at will is a really powerful advantage. And in the RMB, 2d6 MD for a melee weapon was pretty dern good (again, at no cost).

You can still get a 2d6MD melee weapon. Vibro Sword.

That requires a power cell, is physically apparent on you, and perhaps most importantly, can be destroyed.
Psi-sword for the win.

[Crazy Lou]

Yeah, but vibro swords don't get significantly more powerful as you level up. You have to take the time to draw them, and they're really obvious that you're carrying them and armed. A CK is NEVER unarmed. Even mind melters can run out of ISP, but a CK can summon and dispell a slightly less powerful psi-sword, at no cost of actions, dozens or even hundreds of times a day if he really wanted or had to. Plus the new ones get funky (but really useful) psybernetic bonded, regenerating armor at level four. Also, the paired weapons starts at level 2 doesn't it, not level 3? Throw in the new attribute bonuses they get to almost every attribute, and their boatload of skills, and you're looking at a seriously powerful OCC. And very versatile, if you pick your skills and psionics right. And then of course their previously mentioned, monsterous anti-tech powers.

[Crucible]

I'd say the original RMB Cyber-knight was more powerful than the current one, if you base it upon what's written in the book.

Yes, the RUE made them anti-tech supermen. But they've always had a ton of solid skills, and an energy sword you can summon at will is a really powerful advantage. And in the RMB, 2d6 MD for a melee weapon was pretty dern good (again, at no cost).

ummm... did you notice the automatic dodge that the new cyberknight can get, by any chance?

Hence the "anti-tech superman" comment.

I'd say the original RMB Cyber-knight was more powerful than the current one, if you base it upon what's written in the book.

Yes, the RUE made them anti-tech supermen. But they've always had a ton of solid skills, and an energy sword you can summon at will is a really powerful advantage. And in the RMB, 2d6 MD for a melee weapon was pretty dern good (again, at no cost).

You can still get a 2d6MD melee weapon. Vibro Sword.

That requires a power cell, is physically apparent on you, and perhaps most importantly, can be destroyed.
Psi-sword for the win.

What are you talking about? Psi Sword is 1d6MD at 1st level for both books...

[Ziggurat the Eternal]

It immediately goes up at level 2 and 3 I think, and a Master Psychic Cyber-Knight also gets a psi-sword thats nearly as strong as a mind melters. Also, he gets armor that is always on, and can get the same Psi-armors as the Mind Melter, or a few of the other powers. Master Psychic Cyber-Knights can be pretty Epic.

[Crucible]

It immediately goes up at level 2 and 3 I think, and a Master Psychic Cyber-Knight also gets a psi-sword thats nearly as strong as a mind melters. Also, he gets armor that is always on, and can get the same Psi-armors as the Mind Melter, or a few of the other powers. Master Psychic Cyber-Knights can be pretty Epic.

No complaints here. I was just wondering how the one in the old book was more powerful than he new one...

[Crazy Lou]

It immediately goes up at level 2 and 3 I think, and a Master Psychic Cyber-Knight also gets a psi-sword thats nearly as strong as a mind melters. Also, he gets armor that is always on, and can get the same Psi-armors as the Mind Melter, or a few of the other powers. Master Psychic Cyber-Knights can be pretty Epic.

No complaints here. I was just wondering how the one in the old book was more powerful than he new one...

Oh, hahaha. It wasn't. I think maybe whoever said that meant that it was more powerful relatively (ie: like when RMB was the only book). I still disagree about that too, but I think that's what he meant.

[Crucible]

It immediately goes up at level 2 and 3 I think, and a Master Psychic Cyber-Knight also gets a psi-sword thats nearly as strong as a mind melters. Also, he gets armor that is always on, and can get the same Psi-armors as the Mind Melter, or a few of the other powers. Master Psychic Cyber-Knights can be pretty Epic.

No complaints here. I was just wondering how the one in the old book was more powerful than he new one...

Oh, hahaha. It wasn't. I think maybe whoever said that meant that it was more powerful relatively (ie: like when RMB was the only book). I still disagree about that too, but I think that's what he meant.

Any OCC can be DEVASTATING in the hands of the right player. LOL. I think you of all people know this as well.

[Jason Richards]

Cyber-Knights get a huge advantage in the skills department over any other man-at-arms. When listing their WPs, it really should say "All of them."

People lose sight of what the Cyber-Knight is, in my opinion. The class isn't built to rely on a Psi-Sword. They're called "Cyber-Knights" because they are knights that use technology, armor, high-tech weapons, etc. The thing about them being what is effectively an anti-Coalition character class and having special anti-tech powers is all very revisionist.

[Crucible]

Cyber-Knights get a huge advantage in the skills department over any other man-at-arms. When listing their WPs, it really should say "All of them."

People lose sight of what the Cyber-Knight is, in my opinion. The class isn't built to rely on a Psi-Sword. They're called "Cyber-Knights" because they are knights that use technology, armor, high-tech weapons, etc. The thing about them being what is effectively an anti-Coalition character class and having special anti-tech powers is all very revisionist.

The new anti-tech powers do fall in line with them being an anti-CS PC/NPC but it also takes them out of the noble knight wondering the land fighting monsters,who tend to reley on natural abilities making their anti-tech powers moot.

That was my biggest issue, how is he supposed to fight the supernatural with anti-tech? Made for SoT changes/retcon...

[Crucible]

Cyber-Knights get a huge advantage in the skills department over any other man-at-arms. When listing their WPs, it really should say "All of them."

People lose sight of what the Cyber-Knight is, in my opinion. The class isn't built to rely on a Psi-Sword. They're called "Cyber-Knights" because they are knights that use technology, armor, high-tech weapons, etc. The thing about them being what is effectively an anti-Coalition character class and having special anti-tech powers is all very revisionist.

The new anti-tech powers do fall in line with them being an anti-CS PC/NPC but it also takes them out of the noble knight wondering the land fighting monsters,who tend to reley on natural abilities making their anti-tech powers moot.

That was my biggest issue, how is he supposed to fight the supernatural with anti-tech? Made for SoT changes/retcon...

Too true, and unfortunate for the Megaverse.

Yeah especially with the Minion War.

[Crucible]

There seems to be alot of hype about the Minion War. That it might fix stuff in Rifts some how.

I realy don't want to get my hopes up.

15yrs I've been waiting for some changes made to this game. 1994...I'm ready for something new.

[Shark_Force]

who knows. maybe there'll be another retcon to the cyberknights to make them uber against the supernatural (personally, i would welcome such a change, but am not particularly expecting it).

or maybe a new group within the cyber-knights will arise that focuses on anti-supernatural/magic stuff... sort of a combination of cyber-knight + sea inquisitor?

[Mack]

Personally, I'd make two sub-classes of Cyber-Knight. The anti-tech version that we have now, and a anti-supernatural version with similar abilities. The only substantial difference would be that a squire would have to choose which path to follow and possibly find a new mentor half-way through his training. Otherwise the two types would freely mingle with each other.

[Crazy Lou]

Cyber-Knights get a huge advantage in the skills department over any other man-at-arms. When listing their WPs, it really should say "All of them."

People lose sight of what the Cyber-Knight is, in my opinion. The class isn't built to rely on a Psi-Sword. They're called "Cyber-Knights" because they are knights that use technology, armor, high-tech weapons, etc. The thing about them being what is effectively an anti-Coalition character class and having special anti-tech powers is all very revisionist.

The new anti-tech powers do fall in line with them being an anti-CS PC/NPC but it also takes them out of the noble knight wondering the land fighting monsters,who tend to reley on natural abilities making their anti-tech powers moot.

That was my biggest issue, how is he supposed to fight the supernatural with anti-tech? Made for SoT changes/retcon...

Yeah... I never got that either. I agree that anti-SN would've made more sense. Especially considering that the CKs were around and well established way before the CS was a real threat, right?

[Crazy Lou]

Personally, I'd make two sub-classes of Cyber-Knight. The anti-tech version that we have now, and a anti-supernatural version with similar abilities. The only substantial difference would be that a squire would have to choose which path to follow and possibly find a new mentor half-way through his training. Otherwise the two types would freely mingle with each other.

This would be cool. I think this could be really nice. Hopefully that will eventually happen. It would make a lot of sense. But because of the history of the CKs, the anti-tech versions would probably have to be the "newer" of the two, historically speaking, and maybe have been a sort of splinter off the main faction? Some CKs came to the conclusion that the CS was now the greatest threat in the land and so they needed to shift their focus to oppose them instead?

[Crucible]

Cyber-Knights get a huge advantage in the skills department over any other man-at-arms. When listing their WPs, it really should say "All of them."

People lose sight of what the Cyber-Knight is, in my opinion. The class isn't built to rely on a Psi-Sword. They're called "Cyber-Knights" because they are knights that use technology, armor, high-tech weapons, etc. The thing about them being what is effectively an anti-Coalition character class and having special anti-tech powers is all very revisionist.

The new anti-tech powers do fall in line with them being an anti-CS PC/NPC but it also takes them out of the noble knight wondering the land fighting monsters,who tend to reley on natural abilities making their anti-tech powers moot.

That was my biggest issue, how is he supposed to fight the supernatural with anti-tech? Made for SoT changes/retcon...

Yeah... I never got that either. I agree that anti-SN would've made more sense. Especially considering that the CKs were around and well established way before the CS was a real threat, right?

I thought they had originated in Palladium...guess not. anti-Tech blows me away...its like..."Why?"

[Crazy Lou]

The founder of the cyber-knights originated in Palladium.

Is that in the SoT book?

[Mack]

The founder of the cyber-knights originated in Palladium.

Is that in the SoT book?

No, it's not. I'm curious where he got that from.

[Crazy Lou]

I don't have that book, so I don't know. But regardless, the CK class isn't a Palladium one, which means Coake must've developed the class once he got to Rifts Earth, which still puts its development well before any sort of powerful, threatening, tech society existed. Their original purpose was more monster/SN/magic alligned. Protecting the innocent little people from the crazy stuff from the rifts and the chaos that's everywhere right?

[Mack]

The founder of the cyber-knights originated in Palladium.

Is that in the SoT book?

No, it's not. I'm curious where he got that from.

It is in the SoT cyber-knights book, Lord Coake came from palladium, thats why he has all the cool magic items and a longer than normal lifespan.

Please cite a page number.

[Crucible]

I don't have that book, so I don't know. But regardless, the CK class isn't a Palladium one, which means Coake must've developed the class once he got to Rifts Earth, which still puts its development well before any sort of powerful, threatening, tech society existed. Their original purpose was more monster/SN/magic alligned. Protecting the innocent little people from the crazy stuff from the rifts and the chaos that's everywhere right?

Yes you are right. The Cyber-Knight was developed on Rifts earth, it is not a Palladium class and never was, and I never said it was.

I think he started as a Ranger. This is what I meant though and it still seems a bit ookie to me.

[Crazy Lou]

I don't have that book, so I don't know. But regardless, the CK class isn't a Palladium one, which means Coake must've developed the class once he got to Rifts Earth, which still puts its development well before any sort of powerful, threatening, tech society existed. Their original purpose was more monster/SN/magic alligned. Protecting the innocent little people from the crazy stuff from the rifts and the chaos that's everywhere right?

Yes you are right. The Cyber-Knight was developed on Rifts earth, it is not a Palladium class and never was, and I never said it was.

I didn't think you said it was. I was just kinda explaining more my reasoning behind the idea of the newer anti-tech ones being a splinter off the original anti-SN ones. The point was just to make sure that they were founded pre-CS powerhouse-ness

[Lenwen]

You know what I find funny ?

Psionic based Fighter class learns to counter Tech ..

Yet .. magic which is always and forever .. evolving .. still after well .. forever .. can not ..

[Prysus]

The founder of the cyber-knights originated in Palladium.

Is that in the SoT book?

No, it's not. I'm curious where he got that from.

It is in the SoT cyber-knights book, Lord Coake came from palladium, thats why he has all the cool magic items and a longer than normal lifespan.

Please cite a page number.

Greetings and Salutations. If you need a page number, it's really easy to find (you can look at the table of contents and guess at the sections). However, to help, I'd suggest two places (because they mention it twice, maybe more). The first time is on page 18 about "The genesis of justice" (at the start of the O.C.C.) and continues to page 21 (where it also talks about a Chiang-Ku helping develop the fighting style and the ability to create a psi-sword). It mentions his origins and his long life span. It talks about it again at page 75 where it goes into Lord Coake's write up. It doesn't say the Palladium World by name, but it's fairly clear. It mentions a world of magic, knights, kings and queens, as well as the world "Goblin, Ogre, Wolfen, Elf" originated from his homeworld. Also, he's a member of the Defilers (which is from the Palladium World). The Cyber-Knights (in their current form) originated in 18 P.A. (for the record), so I don't know where that falls into the Rifts timeline (don't know the setting well enough), though he started the group 70 or 80 years before the P.A. Calendar (it was a basic group, but not the Cyber-Knights as they are in the present until 18 P.A.). On a side not, it mentions he didn't feel familiar with the "alien technology" so he was more comfortable with melee combat and magic. Perhaps this mentality would cause the anti-tech style (random thought). Hope some of that helps. Thank you for your time and patience, please have a nice day. Farewell and safe journeys for now.

[Mack]

It talks about it again at page 75 where it goes into Lord Coake's write up. It doesn't say the Palladium World by name, but it's fairly clear. It mentions a world of magic, knights, kings and queens, as well as the world "Goblin, Ogre, Wolfen, Elf" originated from his homeworld. Also, he's a member of the Defilers (which is from the Palladium World).

And this illustrates my point. The author took great pain to NOT say Palladium. He avoided it on several occassions.

[Lenwen]

I gotta say Mack is on it so far that I am concerned. If he did come from palladium world it would have been too easy for him to simply state the obvious ..

Since he had in fact avoided doing this.. In my opinion that would mean that it is not the Palladium world.

Just my 2 cp's ..

[sennin]

They may not mention Palladium specifically for a few reasons. First, what if the only PB game that the reader knows about is Rifts? It does not help much to say "Lord Coake hails from Palladium." Also, it could be for fluff reasons - adds a bit of "mystery" to his background. But, as mentioned before, he was a member of the Defilers. The Defilers are a Palladium group. If A=B and B=C, then A=C.

[Lenwen]

They may not mention Palladium specifically for a few reasons. First, what if the only PB game that the reader knows about is Rifts? It does not help much to say "Lord Coake hails from Palladium." Also, it could be for fluff reasons - adds a bit of "mystery" to his background. But, as mentioned before, he was a member of the Defilers. The Defilers are a Palladium group. If A=B and B=C, then A=C.

But the tricky part of all of it .. is wether or not that Lord Coake was in fact .. Born on the Palladium world.

Or .. rather travelled there via .. Rifts ..

[Crucible]

You guys will carelessly argue over anything. He is not from Rifts Earth, the tech was low, KS was the GM using Palladium...he is an Anti Tech savant...makes no sense, but who cares...geez.

[Mack]

You guys will carelessly argue over anything. He is not from Rifts Earth, the tech was low, KS was the GM using Palladium...he is an Anti Tech savant...makes no sense, but who cares...geez.

According to p21 of SoT4, the Cyber-Knight abilities did not manifest until well after Lord Coake arrived on Rifts Earth, and required the help of a Chiang-Ku dragon.

[Prysus]

Greetings and Salutations. A huge part of me is just saying let this go, and I probably will, but before I do I just want to make sure I understand the stance of Mack and Lenwen.

1) He comes from a world that is fuedal with kings, queens, knights, magic, and a demon presence (which describes Palladium Fantasy well).

2) He comes from a world that is not Earth. That rules out Rifts Earth, Heroes Unlimited, Robotech, TMNT, N&S, Mystic China, Nightbane, Systems Failure, Recon, After the Bomb, and Beyond the Supernatural.

3) He comes from the world where Ogres, Goblins, and Wolfen originated (which is the Palladium World if you read the book). I didn't include Elves in the list because their origins could at least be debatable.

4) A founding member of the Defilers who are from the Palladium World (except at least one who WAS from Earth's past).

4) Opinion: He could say the name of his world, but since it's not likely anyone would know the name it would likely do no one any good, and is far more effective to describe the place than give a name without meaning.

Now, despite those facts (except for 4 which is just my thoughts on the matter), the arguement is that he did NOT come from the Palladium World, just a world that is EXACTLY like it? I'm not going to force my opinions or the facts down anyone's throat, and they're welcome to ignore them. I just want to make sure I understand the stance because it seems kind of sillly (from the way I'm reading it right now, but I'm giving the benefit of the doubt I'm misunderstanding something). All right, I guess that's all for now, I just had to ask. Thank you for your time, please have a nice day. Farewell and safe journeys to all.

P.S. I don't believe Kevin has ever officially called it the Palladium World in fluff text before. For some reason I always got the feeling he avoided giving it a name (in fluff). Though it is called that a few times in the Palladium Fantasy main book (because it needs to be referrred to as something in the book, just never in fluff).

[Mack]

P.S. I don't believe Kevin has ever officially called it the Palladium World in fluff text before. For some reason I always got the feeling he avoided giving it a name (in fluff). Though it is called that a few times in the Palladium Fantasy main book (because it needs to be referrred to as something in the book, just never in fluff).[/justify]

Yes, he has. Though it's going to bug me now because I can't specify which NPC write-up it's in. When I find it I'll post it.

And don't get me wrong, I agree it most likely is Palladium that Coake hails from. But it's an assumption, not a fact.

[Crucible]

You guys will carelessly argue over anything. He is not from Rifts Earth, the tech was low, KS was the GM using Palladium...he is an Anti Tech savant...makes no sense, but who cares...geez.

According to p21 of SoT4, the Cyber-Knight abilities did not manifest until well after Lord Coake arrived on Rifts Earth, and required the help of a Chiang-Ku dragon.

Never said this was incorrect. My ONLY point is that he came from a Palladium-like world (since I have to be uber specific at this board in order to be understood one iota), came to Rifts Earth before tech was a major issue and suddenly his guys are Buffy the Techie Slayers? Why? Why not magic banes, or SN bashers? Whatever. I'm done anyways and losing patience with many of the responses here. Its like talking to droids.

[Mack]

You guys will carelessly argue over anything. He is not from Rifts Earth, the tech was low, KS was the GM using Palladium...he is an Anti Tech savant...makes no sense, but who cares...geez.

According to p21 of SoT4, the Cyber-Knight abilities did not manifest until well after Lord Coake arrived on Rifts Earth, and required the help of a Chiang-Ku dragon.

Never said this was incorrect. My ONLY point is that he came from a Palladium-like world (since I have to be uber specific at this board in order to be understood one iota), came to Rifts Earth before tech was a major issue and suddenly his guys are Buffy the Techie Slayers? Why? Why not magic banes, or SN bashers? Whatever. I'm done anyways and losing patience with many of the responses here. Its like talking to droids.

I think I misread your post. When you used the phrase "Anti Tech savant" I thought you were saying Coake had the Cyber-Knight anti-tech powers prior to his arrival on Rifts Earth. That's why I pointed out they were developed afterwards.

[Nekira Sudacne]

The founder of the cyber knights is FROM palladium, but he developed it after coming to Rifts Earth.