Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

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zarus
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Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by zarus »

I'm guessing Triax 2? I know they have the Glitter Boy variants and at least 1 gun that actually surpasses the Boom Gun.
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by Emerald MoonSilver »

Northern gun book 1 and 2 have a wide variety of interesting new toys to play with, so does the merc ops book.
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by hup7 »

"best" is pretty subjective...

I mean the Devastator Mk 2 has Main Body: 2150 MDC, a gun that does 4d6x10 MDC and a bunch of missiles but it is also 58' tall and requires 8 crew (can run with 4).

There are some vehicles with 10,000+ MDC?

Are you looking for the most MDC? Highest firepower? Single pilot?
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by Killer Cyborg »

Sourcebook 1 lets you make your own, and that's always been my favorite.
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by Warshield73 »

Best is incredibly subject. My criteria is simple: Wide variety, can be used by NPCs and PCs alike, not so powerful that it renders all older units obsolete.

Going by this I think WB 5 Triax and NGR is still the best. Older vehicles could still compete but it introduced units with new capabilities and added variety to bandits and mercs.

The Northern Gun books are good but a lot of those units have stats that do not match the desertion or stated purpose. Still great books but don't entirely live up to WB 5. Triax 2 is another power creep sprint that really renders most other units obsolete.
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by Blue_Lion »

Warshield73 wrote:Best is incredibly subject. My criteria is simple: Wide variety, can be used by NPCs and PCs alike, not so powerful that it renders all older units obsolete.

Going by this I think WB 5 Triax and NGR is still the best. Older vehicles could still compete but it introduced units with new capabilities and added variety to bandits and mercs.

The Northern Gun books are good but a lot of those units have stats that do not match the desertion or stated purpose. Still great books but don't entirely live up to WB 5. Triax 2 is another power creep sprint that really renders most other units obsolete.

Depends on where you are to.

In NA triax would be more rare than NG.
Titian robotics tends to have the best deals on the units.
Best source for NA that will not get you on CS most wanted list would probably be NG.
IN japan it would be the Japan book.
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by Warshield73 »

Blue_Lion wrote:Depends on where you are to.

In NA triax would be more rare than NG.
Titian robotics tends to have the best deals on the units.
Best source for NA that will not get you on CS most wanted list would probably be NG.
IN japan it would be the Japan book.

The problem with making it area specific is that for most regions you have one book, two at most. Only North America has large numbers of books. The OP didn't ask which region has the best mechs, just which books.
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by The Dark Elf »

The GMG
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Rifter 55 The Ancestral Mystic P.C.C.
Rifter 59 The Lopanic Games adventure "The Lion, the Ditch & the Warlock". Illustrations to this adventure can be found here.
Rifter 71 & 72 Double Issue Ninjas & Superspies adventure "On a Wing & a Prayer"
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by ShadowLogan »

I think it really does come to what the criteria is here.
Megaversally Rifts mecha aren't necessarily the best, there is stuff in the discontinued licensed material (Macross 2 or Robotech 1E or 2E) that outclasses them in some way (possibly multiple ways).

Still the "best" power armor or robot is also going to vary depending on the circumstances and what you need done. It can also come down to how well the GM manages things.
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by hup7 »

Yeah need some input from the OP about what they are really after?

My vote for best - well the SDF-1 of course. :)

But I jest, honestly I look for something versatile - GB great in the right situation, but versatile it is not. On the other hand transformable mecha give you multiple options in one. A veritech is still pretty decent, although low MDC compared with more recent stuff (yes, I know they can be armoured up as per CB1). Additionally if you are travelling in the Mech some sort of comfort would be a must personally. Spending any amount of real time in a GB would suck.
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by Blue_Lion »

The Dark Elf wrote:The GMG

LOL hard to have more than that book.
The Clones are coming you shall all be replaced, but who is to say you have not been replaced already.

Master of Type-O and the obvios.

Soon my army oc clones and winged-monkies will rule the world but first, must .......

I may debate canon and RAW, but the games I run are highly house ruled. So I am not debating for how I play but about how the system works as written.
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by Blue_Lion »

Warshield73 wrote:
Blue_Lion wrote:Depends on where you are to.

In NA triax would be more rare than NG.
Titian robotics tends to have the best deals on the units.
Best source for NA that will not get you on CS most wanted list would probably be NG.
IN japan it would be the Japan book.

The problem with making it area specific is that for most regions you have one book, two at most. Only North America has large numbers of books. The OP didn't ask which region has the best mechs, just which books.

I was pointing out that the location would matter.
Basically it is so vague as to come across as what book to buy for cool robots. So location would matter.
The Clones are coming you shall all be replaced, but who is to say you have not been replaced already.

Master of Type-O and the obvios.

Soon my army oc clones and winged-monkies will rule the world but first, must .......

I may debate canon and RAW, but the games I run are highly house ruled. So I am not debating for how I play but about how the system works as written.
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by ShadowLogan »

How many Power Armor and Robots are in Rifts?
Based on my incomplete Rifts Library...
RMB-era Books:
-114x Power Armor
-79x Piloted Robots (includes MiO VRRDS and their manned variants, but not the 8x Triax VR variants or the MOM/'brain transfer versions just the manned)
-6x Transformable units
RUE-era Books (I manually filtered out overlaps from RMB):
-21x Power Armor
-14x Piloted Robots
-1x Transformable units
Minimum Total between:
-135x Power Armor
-93x Pilot Robots
-7x Transformable units (DB8, DB2, DB3, WB2, WB7)
Grand Total: 235 minimum (Note I do not have Black Market or Northern Gun which are the two main books that would add to this, though I'm sure other WB/DB/SBs that I do not currently own that would add to this). That is a lot of units to consider across a host of books to pick the "best".

There are also autonomous tech and TW/magical Robots in various roles (your Skelebot, your worker, or your mount types) that have not been counted though could be, I also avoided the Cyborg level (pilot practically lives in the unit) and some on the list have "knockoffs" that are not considered (I did consider model variants, though not "configuration" variants). Obviously I have also left out Megaversal lines like Robotech (~89 in 1E and ~104 in 2E), Macross 2 (20), HU/Atb/TMNT, and The Rifter. I might also have missed a few due to their NPC placement or being "incomplete" (IMHO, like the Vernulian PA or the Farie Bot 'bot vehicle).

Now in terms of game mechanics (before WP/HTH skills or race/class) from the above list:
-APM: at 1st level with Elite/Boxing, the difference is typically 1 APM, though I did find some that used "basic" as their "elite" form in RMB era (surprised to see that)
-Parry: the best I could find was the AT-1063 from Japan (+7), technically one of the MiO VRRDS is +8 but is an exotic setup.
-Dodge: NW's Wild Weasel SAMAS with +9, at +8 you have the Sidewinder SAMAS (NW) and the Kittani Flying Fox PA (WB21) and the VRRDS
-Roll: +7 goes to MiO Mk4 and Mk5 Glitterboy, +6 for the VRRDS, +5 for Japan's IPA-70 PA
-Auto-Dodge: +3 for Kittani designs (WB2/6/7) with the innate feature (everyone else cannot compete here). Pretty rare feature in Rifts, put a pilot who has auto-dodge outside of the unit like a Juicer...
-Initiative: +4 from the Wild Weasel (NW) and a few of FQ (WB22) GB suits, the VRRDS suit and the CS IAR-5 Robot and Tarnow (SB3) TC-R5 Robot. Naruni has 2 PA suits from DB8 that are +4. RMB-era really didn't do initiative bonus, though RUE has and introduced a low end bonus of +1/2 from elite skill, so if converting the RMB-era stuff to RUE-era those bonuses might go even higher
-Strike-Ranged (non-missile): +8 Kittani Dragon Dreadnaught Robot (WB2), +4 for a variety of PA (TW OCC's PA in RMB, Angrar Mk2 PA from Merc, Kittani Equestrian PA from WB2, Triax X-10 and X-1000 along with the NEMA R107 SAMAS all from SB1r)
-Strike-Melee: +4 Kittani Dragon Dreadnaught Robot (Super, WB2), WH-GAR-06 Robot (WB15) and TC-R5 (SB3) are also no slouch, note the exotic VRRDS are +6. The Mk3 Glitterboy PA (MiO) is +6

Main Body MDC: assuming we avoid the Super Robots like the Triax Devestator (range is 3000-1000), the highest main body MDC goes to the Japanese IR-4000 at 1000 at it might be a Super (followed by the CS IAR-3 'bot from WB11 just short by 10 and short by 50 the Mastodon from WB9). The highest MDC for power amor is the Triax/FQ Tarantua Glitterboy at 850, and 7 of the top 10 PA by main body MDC are Glitterboys (Tarnow design in SB3, Kittani WB2 design though this is more 'bot IMHO, and a Naruni design in DB3)

Weapon Diversity: the Coalition IAR-4 Robot and PA-300 PA (WB11) and comes in at the most options (though I'm less confident here, since I grouped like systems together and trimmed melee combat down to unarmed and with weapon if its standard). Though here the average number for 'bot or PA (regardless of RUE or RMB era) is 3 (rounding to nearest whole number) so if looking for diversity that might be something to consider.

Weapon Range (non-missile): technically that falls to a Japan AT-1053 Robot design with 7miles (IIRC), then the Battleram Robot from DB2, tailing by just a bit is the Traix X-2020 (WB31), and then the Boomgun (11,000ft) found on Glitterboys and several other platforms. Most guns have "typical" generic ranges (6000 or 4000 are common for rail guns, energy weapons tend to not exceed 4000ft though some lasers are known to).

Weapon Damage (non-missile): Kittani Dragon Dreadnought Robot (WB2) and Arkhon Great Cyclops Robot (WB9) both can do 8d4x10 and the Naruni (DB8) NE-DXZ-09 'bot doing 6d4x10 (better minimum damage than the 4d6x10 of which there are 11 platforms capable of this in Rifts w/o using missiles, some may be with combined gunfire). Power Armor is the ARchie HPA Mk1 PA reserved for Hagon (SB2) and Mk4 Glitterboy (MiO) both do 4d6x10.

Melee Damage: Kittani War Shark Robot (WB7) has a melee attack doing 2d6x100, though this is a super robot (and is not humanoid), Batteram Robot (DB2) and Naruni Deathknight Robot do 2d6x10 in melee, and the Naruni Mecha Knight PA (Merc) does 1d6x10 (no close competition here either for PA).
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by Mlp7029 »

ShadowLogan wrote:How many Power Armor and Robots are in Rifts?
Based on my incomplete Rifts Library...
RMB-era Books:
-114x Power Armor
-79x Piloted Robots (includes MiO VRRDS and their manned variants, but not the 8x Triax VR variants or the MOM/'brain transfer versions just the manned)
-6x Transformable units
RUE-era Books (I manually filtered out overlaps from RMB):
-21x Power Armor
-14x Piloted Robots
-1x Transformable units
Minimum Total between:
-135x Power Armor
-93x Pilot Robots
-7x Transformable units (DB8, DB2, DB3, WB2, WB7)
Grand Total: 235 minimum (Note I do not have Black Market or Northern Gun which are the two main books that would add to this, though I'm sure other WB/DB/SBs that I do not currently own that would add to this). That is a lot of units to consider across a host of books to pick the "best".

There are also autonomous tech and TW/magical Robots in various roles (your Skelebot, your worker, or your mount types) that have not been counted though could be, I also avoided the Cyborg level (pilot practically lives in the unit) and some on the list have "knockoffs" that are not considered (I did consider model variants, though not "configuration" variants). Obviously I have also left out Megaversal lines like Robotech (~89 in 1E and ~104 in 2E), Macross 2 (20), HU/Atb/TMNT, and The Rifter. I might also have missed a few due to their NPC placement or being "incomplete" (IMHO, like the Vernulian PA or the Farie Bot 'bot vehicle).

Now in terms of game mechanics (before WP/HTH skills or race/class) from the above list:
-APM: at 1st level with Elite/Boxing, the difference is typically 1 APM, though I did find some that used "basic" as their "elite" form in RMB era (surprised to see that)
-Parry: the best I could find was the AT-1063 from Japan (+7), technically one of the MiO VRRDS is +8 but is an exotic setup.
-Dodge: NW's Wild Weasel SAMAS with +9, at +8 you have the Sidewinder SAMAS (NW) and the Kittani Flying Fox PA (WB21) and the VRRDS
-Roll: +7 goes to MiO Mk4 and Mk5 Glitterboy, +6 for the VRRDS, +5 for Japan's IPA-70 PA
-Auto-Dodge: +3 for Kittani designs (WB2/6/7) with the innate feature (everyone else cannot compete here). Pretty rare feature in Rifts, put a pilot who has auto-dodge outside of the unit like a Juicer...
-Initiative: +4 from the Wild Weasel (NW) and a few of FQ (WB22) GB suits, the VRRDS suit and the CS IAR-5 Robot and Tarnow (SB3) TC-R5 Robot. Naruni has 2 PA suits from DB8 that are +4. RMB-era really didn't do initiative bonus, though RUE has and introduced a low end bonus of +1/2 from elite skill, so if converting the RMB-era stuff to RUE-era those bonuses might go even higher
-Strike-Ranged (non-missile): +8 Kittani Dragon Dreadnaught Robot (WB2), +4 for a variety of PA (TW OCC's PA in RMB, Angrar Mk2 PA from Merc, Kittani Equestrian PA from WB2, Triax X-10 and X-1000 along with the NEMA R107 SAMAS all from SB1r)
-Strike-Melee: +4 Kittani Dragon Dreadnaught Robot (Super, WB2), WH-GAR-06 Robot (WB15) and TC-R5 (SB3) are also no slouch, note the exotic VRRDS are +6. The Mk3 Glitterboy PA (MiO) is +6

Main Body MDC: assuming we avoid the Super Robots like the Triax Devestator (range is 3000-1000), the highest main body MDC goes to the Japanese IR-4000 at 1000 at it might be a Super (followed by the CS IAR-3 'bot from WB11 just short by 10 and short by 50 the Mastodon from WB9). The highest MDC for power amor is the Triax/FQ Tarantua Glitterboy at 850, and 7 of the top 10 PA by main body MDC are Glitterboys (Tarnow design in SB3, Kittani WB2 design though this is more 'bot IMHO, and a Naruni design in DB3)

Weapon Diversity: the Coalition IAR-4 Robot and PA-300 PA (WB11) and comes in at the most options (though I'm less confident here, since I grouped like systems together and trimmed melee combat down to unarmed and with weapon if its standard). Though here the average number for 'bot or PA (regardless of RUE or RMB era) is 3 (rounding to nearest whole number) so if looking for diversity that might be something to consider.

Weapon Range (non-missile): technically that falls to a Japan AT-1053 Robot design with 7miles (IIRC), then the Battleram Robot from DB2, tailing by just a bit is the Traix X-2020 (WB31), and then the Boomgun (11,000ft) found on Glitterboys and several other platforms. Most guns have "typical" generic ranges (6000 or 4000 are common for rail guns, energy weapons tend to not exceed 4000ft though some lasers are known to).

Weapon Damage (non-missile): Kittani Dragon Dreadnought Robot (WB2) and Arkhon Great Cyclops Robot (WB9) both can do 8d4x10 and the Naruni (DB8) NE-DXZ-09 'bot doing 6d4x10 (better minimum damage than the 4d6x10 of which there are 11 platforms capable of this in Rifts w/o using missiles, some may be with combined gunfire). Power Armor is the ARchie HPA Mk1 PA reserved for Hagon (SB2) and Mk4 Glitterboy (MiO) both do 4d6x10.

Melee Damage: Kittani War Shark Robot (WB7) has a melee attack doing 2d6x100, though this is a super robot (and is not humanoid), Batteram Robot (DB2) and Naruni Deathknight Robot do 2d6x10 in melee, and the Naruni Mecha Knight PA (Merc) does 1d6x10 (no close competition here either for PA).
The War Shark 2D6x100 must be a misprint.
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by ShadowLogan »

Mlp7029 wrote:The War Shark 2D6x100 must be a misprint.

I double checked to make sure I hadn't done a data entry error in the tables I put the data into (I had some data entry errors in other areas, mostly missing data), but it is correct. Now it might be a misprint (or corrected in a later printing) in WB7, but I do not know I am going with the data as I have it in the books I have (I've heard, but have no actual examples that book printings can and do introduce changes).

This case might be one of the rare examples of actually "scaling" damage, something PB isn't exactly known to do.

I will say the War Shark Mk4 (and its smaller Mk5 cousin) might not belong on the list, they are technically considered submarines and not a robot, I included them due to the Kittani making the vehicles "mimic" actual creature in this case (making it a Robot IMHO). It's also worth remembering that this unit would also only be able to bite in the ocean/water, and this is one of those robots that is so large in size it wouldn't necessarily follow the same expectations for damage (one of the Reacher's of the Deep in WB7 does 1d4x100MD to large targets and another lower damage to "smaller" objects, something similar might apply with the War Shark).
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by zarus »

ShadowLogan wrote:How many Power Armor and Robots are in Rifts?
Based on my incomplete Rifts Library...
RMB-era Books:
-114x Power Armor
-79x Piloted Robots (includes MiO VRRDS and their manned variants, but not the 8x Triax VR variants or the MOM/'brain transfer versions just the manned)
-6x Transformable units
RUE-era Books (I manually filtered out overlaps from RMB):
-21x Power Armor
-14x Piloted Robots
-1x Transformable units
Minimum Total between:
-135x Power Armor
-93x Pilot Robots
-7x Transformable units (DB8, DB2, DB3, WB2, WB7)
Grand Total: 235 minimum (Note I do not have Black Market or Northern Gun which are the two main books that would add to this, though I'm sure other WB/DB/SBs that I do not currently own that would add to this). That is a lot of units to consider across a host of books to pick the "best".

There are also autonomous tech and TW/magical Robots in various roles (your Skelebot, your worker, or your mount types) that have not been counted though could be, I also avoided the Cyborg level (pilot practically lives in the unit) and some on the list have "knockoffs" that are not considered (I did consider model variants, though not "configuration" variants). Obviously I have also left out Megaversal lines like Robotech (~89 in 1E and ~104 in 2E), Macross 2 (20), HU/Atb/TMNT, and The Rifter. I might also have missed a few due to their NPC placement or being "incomplete" (IMHO, like the Vernulian PA or the Farie Bot 'bot vehicle).

Now in terms of game mechanics (before WP/HTH skills or race/class) from the above list:
-APM: at 1st level with Elite/Boxing, the difference is typically 1 APM, though I did find some that used "basic" as their "elite" form in RMB era (surprised to see that)
-Parry: the best I could find was the AT-1063 from Japan (+7), technically one of the MiO VRRDS is +8 but is an exotic setup.
-Dodge: NW's Wild Weasel SAMAS with +9, at +8 you have the Sidewinder SAMAS (NW) and the Kittani Flying Fox PA (WB21) and the VRRDS
-Roll: +7 goes to MiO Mk4 and Mk5 Glitterboy, +6 for the VRRDS, +5 for Japan's IPA-70 PA
-Auto-Dodge: +3 for Kittani designs (WB2/6/7) with the innate feature (everyone else cannot compete here). Pretty rare feature in Rifts, put a pilot who has auto-dodge outside of the unit like a Juicer...
-Initiative: +4 from the Wild Weasel (NW) and a few of FQ (WB22) GB suits, the VRRDS suit and the CS IAR-5 Robot and Tarnow (SB3) TC-R5 Robot. Naruni has 2 PA suits from DB8 that are +4. RMB-era really didn't do initiative bonus, though RUE has and introduced a low end bonus of +1/2 from elite skill, so if converting the RMB-era stuff to RUE-era those bonuses might go even higher
-Strike-Ranged (non-missile): +8 Kittani Dragon Dreadnaught Robot (WB2), +4 for a variety of PA (TW OCC's PA in RMB, Angrar Mk2 PA from Merc, Kittani Equestrian PA from WB2, Triax X-10 and X-1000 along with the NEMA R107 SAMAS all from SB1r)
-Strike-Melee: +4 Kittani Dragon Dreadnaught Robot (Super, WB2), WH-GAR-06 Robot (WB15) and TC-R5 (SB3) are also no slouch, note the exotic VRRDS are +6. The Mk3 Glitterboy PA (MiO) is +6

Main Body MDC: assuming we avoid the Super Robots like the Triax Devestator (range is 3000-1000), the highest main body MDC goes to the Japanese IR-4000 at 1000 at it might be a Super (followed by the CS IAR-3 'bot from WB11 just short by 10 and short by 50 the Mastodon from WB9). The highest MDC for power amor is the Triax/FQ Tarantua Glitterboy at 850, and 7 of the top 10 PA by main body MDC are Glitterboys (Tarnow design in SB3, Kittani WB2 design though this is more 'bot IMHO, and a Naruni design in DB3)

Weapon Diversity: the Coalition IAR-4 Robot and PA-300 PA (WB11) and comes in at the most options (though I'm less confident here, since I grouped like systems together and trimmed melee combat down to unarmed and with weapon if its standard). Though here the average number for 'bot or PA (regardless of RUE or RMB era) is 3 (rounding to nearest whole number) so if looking for diversity that might be something to consider.

Weapon Range (non-missile): technically that falls to a Japan AT-1053 Robot design with 7miles (IIRC), then the Battleram Robot from DB2, tailing by just a bit is the Traix X-2020 (WB31), and then the Boomgun (11,000ft) found on Glitterboys and several other platforms. Most guns have "typical" generic ranges (6000 or 4000 are common for rail guns, energy weapons tend to not exceed 4000ft though some lasers are known to).

Weapon Damage (non-missile): Kittani Dragon Dreadnought Robot (WB2) and Arkhon Great Cyclops Robot (WB9) both can do 8d4x10 and the Naruni (DB8) NE-DXZ-09 'bot doing 6d4x10 (better minimum damage than the 4d6x10 of which there are 11 platforms capable of this in Rifts w/o using missiles, some may be with combined gunfire). Power Armor is the ARchie HPA Mk1 PA reserved for Hagon (SB2) and Mk4 Glitterboy (MiO) both do 4d6x10.

Melee Damage: Kittani War Shark Robot (WB7) has a melee attack doing 2d6x100, though this is a super robot (and is not humanoid), Batteram Robot (DB2) and Naruni Deathknight Robot do 2d6x10 in melee, and the Naruni Mecha Knight PA (Merc) does 1d6x10 (no close competition here either for PA).


Holy **** that is more complete of an answer than I would have dared ask for. Thank you so much!

Regarding the Kittani Dragon Dreadnought Robot, which weapon does 8d4x10? I looked over the whole entry and couldn't find a single weapon that does that much by itself. Are you talking about the 4 heads, each of which can do 2d4x10MD with one laser blast?
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by desrocfc »

I don't know, but I hear the Free Quebec military has some nice options, and those Glitter Boys are pretty neat! ;)
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ShadowLogan
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by ShadowLogan »

zarus wrote:Holy **** that is more complete of an answer than I would have dared ask for. Thank you so much!

Thank you. I actually have more on the topic as the above analysis was done after after entering the data into a database to run with a script that would allow them to be ranked in terms of give/take damage in a massive round-robin style play. I didn't post it because getting the results out in a usable format for posting is possible, but one of the ranked script scenarios is "buggy" and taking a long time to complete (the other script scenarios I also ran finished w/n 15minutes this one ran for over an hour before I put a stop to it and I haven't had the time to trace it down if it's due to a data error of some type or something in the script, when I ran them for Robotech the time was comparable between various scenarios).

zarus wrote:Regarding the Kittani Dragon Dreadnought Robot, which weapon does 8d4x10? I looked over the whole entry and couldn't find a single weapon that does that much by itself. Are you talking about the 4 heads, each of which can do 2d4x10MD with one laser blast?

That is not from one single weapon emplacement, but a grouped battery of weapon emplacements that can (or where assumed could) fire together (I don't have the database accessible at the moment). But looking at WB2 directly the previous statement was might be assuming the KDDR was firing its Particle Beam Wing Guns together (it doesn't say they can or can not, and off hand I can not recall if I grouped them or not) OR it was referencing the Laser Option for the 4x Heads that are noted can fire together at the same target (2d4x10 per 4 heads = 8d4x10 total). And I am pretty sure the same can be said for the Arkhon 'bot, it was a battery of guns firing together (it should also be noted Arkhon Tri-Beams do double damage to basically everybody else so that could also factor that in since Arkhons materials are immune to the feature, and Force Fields are pretty rare, so I manually adjusted the damage).

EDIT (I have access to the database now, and it is the 4x Dragon Head Laser Cannons firing in a volley for 8d4x10 and not the PBCs, those where treated as independently).
Last edited by ShadowLogan on Fri May 13, 2022 3:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by pad300 »

A minor note about the APM ratings - If you include auto-firing guns that give extra attacks, I believe the Juicer-Killer Powered Armors (JK1A and JK1B) sweep the field, with 8 extra APM on top of the robot combat ones...
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by ShadowLogan »

pad300 wrote:A minor note about the APM ratings - If you include auto-firing guns that give extra attacks, I believe the Juicer-Killer Powered Armors (JK1A and JK1B) sweep the field, with 8 extra APM on top of the robot combat ones...

Very true, but when discussing the APM I was looking at it from strictly the skill perspective (and at starting Level).

Things to keep in mind with APMs are also influenced by:
- racial/class bonuses even at level 1, not every class/race will provide such but it is important to consider
-character level and skill level (since they are not the same thing), both of which determine the bonuses you get from HTH/RC
-skill selection (did you take Boxing, did you take Basic or Elite Robot/PA Combat)
-some Robot vehicles also intended for a multi-crew, but when operated solo can reduce the pilots APMs, and a multi-crew platform can potentially outclass the auto-system equipped PA (though I do admit this comparison isn't "fair" which is why I avoided considering the auto systems and multi-crew ability, that and it would add to the complexity).
-equipment modifiers (like the auto-system, or MiO's Virtual Reality System versions of stuff has all their bonuses halved for the traditional manned model, etc).
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by Hotrod »

The single most powerful single-attack weapon in a single-pilot suit I know of is the rotary drum missile launcher attachment for the Jaeger in Triax 1. Hard to beat 96-missile volleys.
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ShadowLogan
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by ShadowLogan »

Hotrod wrote:The single most powerful single-attack weapon in a single-pilot suit I know of is the rotary drum missile launcher attachment for the Jaeger in Triax 1. Hard to beat 96-missile volleys.

Actually, the Jaeger in WB5 cannot fire all 96 SRMS in a single volley (it is limited to 48 per text pg60 unless it was changed in a later printing as I have a 2nd Print). That said something that can fire a volley of 48 missiles (any category) IS rare for Rifts, most missile launchers don't appear to be capable of double digit firings AFAIK much less 48 (I manually counted 37 Rifts 'bot/PA missile systems than can fire double digits, out of ~280 in my incomplete Library, rare might be correct term).

I do have to add that missile volleys in general shouldn't be taken as end-all. One problem with them is the amount of damage they can do will vary based on the class/type of missile, which can lead to "sound impressive" but isn't as impressive as a smaller volley with a higher-class missile. In RMB-era the best damage by ranged converted easily enough: 1 LRM = 2MRM =4SRM/Mini, RUE is not as straight forward (and it does have overlap), though they still maintain that each level has a ~1:2 ratio (rounded for simplicity) when going down.

I'm also not sure if its "fair" to compare missile damage vs "gun-style" damage vs "HTH-style" damage as they all have their place in terms of combat.
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Re: Which book has the best power armor and robotics?

Unread post by Shark_Force »

well, if you want the biggest missile volley in rifts then there could in theory be any of the robotech mecha in outcast station. I suspect that at least some of the possibilities would take the crown :)
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