Robotic P.S. in HU2

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13eowulf
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Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by 13eowulf »

I just want to preface this by saying I searched the forums to see if this was asked before, and if it was I could not find it.

In HU2, pg 204, upper left under "1. Increased P.S. & Cost:" is the following text:
HU2, pg 204, upper left wrote:Maximum robot P.S. is 30 or twice its total height, whichever is greater. Also, robotic P.S. is considered superhuman. This means that a 50 foot (15.2 m) tall robot (if one can afford it) could have a P.S. of 100 and do 2D4x10+85 S.D.C. points of damage with a punch.

The phrase "robotic P.S. is considered superhuman." initially seems straight forward, as that power is presented on page 236. However that power does not provide enhanced punch damage, and the example explicitly provides enhanced punch damage of 2D4x10+85.
If we take away the +85, as that is simply the P.S. bonus damage from the example P.S. of 100, we are left with the 2D4x10.
This is the top-end punch damage provided to those with Supernatural P.S. (per the table on 294).
This is a very explicit entry, and cannot be waived away as a math error (unlike the altitude cost example). So, what does that mean, both for punch damage, and lift/carry capacity?

The options as I see them are:
    -Ignore the 'superhuman' wording, and rate it as supernatural per the punch example.
    -Ignore the punch example and rate it as superhuman with normal punch damage.
    -Split the difference, lift/carry per superhuman, punch damage per SNPS table.

Thoughts?
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

The normal punch damage listed...on the SNPS damage scale is from 51-70.

so the difference is between a score from the SNPS to a SHPS score of 100 is 50-30 points difference.
No. Do not use the SNPS table.
OR to say don't without a score modifyer.

51-70 is 2d4x10 normal punch damage range. So dividing the robotic PS score (in HU) for use on the SNPS table by half might work....it would need some playtesting.
-----------
Then there is the question how they came up with the 2d4x10 number. (you're right the +85 is the PS bonus for PS100).

Looking ing the HU1 mainbook didn't give any clues ether.
Last edited by drewkitty ~..~ on Fri Jan 31, 2020 5:44 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by 13eowulf »

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:When taken as a power, with the PS score being 30+2d6 which endes up in the 32-42 point range, the 2d4x10 damage rating is on the lower end of the possible scale. (yah, mid range for w/o any other PS mods...but who dodesn't give a SNPS char any more mods?)

so the difference is between a score of 36 and a score of 100.

Then there is the question how they came up with the 2d4x10 number. (you're right the +85 is the PS bonus for PS100).

Looking ing the HU1 mainbook didn't give any clues ether.

Here is what I am thinking...the '2d4' or 1d8' is the giant hand weapon damage. But the x10 *shrugs*.....maybe a times height/10 with the min being x1.


Subsequent to this I did some searching around in other books for statted robots, like the TMC combat android in the AUGG, and they all follow the pattern of listed punch damages relating to their Robot PS on the SNPS punch table.
I have become convinced that Robotic punch damage in HU2 uses the SNPS table.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

13eowulf wrote:
Subsequent to this I did some searching around in other books for statted robots, like the TMC combat android in the AUGG, and they all follow the pattern of listed punch damages relating to their Robot PS on the SNPS punch table.
I have become convinced that Robotic punch damage in HU2 uses the SNPS table.

Some more plain speaking

HUmm...if this was another game system I would think an update would be coming up to change the wording. Since.....I don't know....someonedidn't use the book standards with their stat'ing out the robots.
But this is PB. Publish 20 books before making an update to the core book to match their creative standard for making NPCs and Stuff. Well...if its for rifts.
I don't see them publishing an update on this. At least not for HU.

P.S. my conclutions in the previus post were mainly based off what is in the HU main book and some math.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by Stone Gargoyle »

I see it as being a GM's call. Personally, I use a special table of damages for different strength levels that I found on the internet years ago. Sadly i do not know specifically where you would locate it now.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

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Starting in HU2 Robotic PS became the same as the minor super power 'Super Human PS'
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by Stone Gargoyle »

SpiritInterface wrote:Starting in HU2 Robotic PS became the same as the minor super power 'Super Human PS'
That has already been covered. What is being discussed is the way damage is calculated for robots.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by SpiritInterface »

Stone Gargoyle wrote:
SpiritInterface wrote:Starting in HU2 Robotic PS became the same as the minor super power 'Super Human PS'
That has already been covered. What is being discussed is the way damage is calculated for robots.


I kept seeing people refer to SNPS which is Supernatural PS.

The damage should be calculated as PS -15 plus the hand or weapon damage. How ever from various other sources suggest a higher damage. The group I am with adds the restrained damage from SNPS to the PS -15 add to hand/weapon for both Robotics and Super Human PS.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

SpiritInterface wrote:
Stone Gargoyle wrote:
SpiritInterface wrote:Starting in HU2 Robotic PS became the same as the minor super power 'Super Human PS'
That has already been covered. What is being discussed is the way damage is calculated for robots.


I kept seeing people refer to SNPS which is Supernatural PS.

The damage should be calculated as PS -15 plus the hand or weapon damage. How ever from various other sources suggest a higher damage. The group I am with adds the restrained damage from SNPS to the PS -15 add to hand/weapon for both Robotics and Super Human PS.

But with the example within the HU Core book in the robotics section the example is using a SHPS score of 100 ...not 66-85 that your math says it should be using.
With your math the 100 SHPS would work out to be 85 on the SNPS damage scale....and the SNPS damage scale doesn't go that high.

Now subtracting 30-49 points from the SHPS score does fit the basic premise you proposed. yes this will move the lower end off the SNPS damage chart for getting more damage then just punch damage of 1d4 for the damage variable.

EXPS and SHPS are not like SNPS, they are mainly just moving the mundane PS to higher scores. Not moving them to 'an order of magnitude' high that SNPS does.

Yes, people abbreviated things...like writing today's date out as 1-31-2020, instead of January thirty-first of the year two-thousand and twenty Anno Domini.
SNPS still reads as supernatural physical str. even if abbreviated.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by SpiritInterface »

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:
SpiritInterface wrote:
Stone Gargoyle wrote:
SpiritInterface wrote:Starting in HU2 Robotic PS became the same as the minor super power 'Super Human PS'
That has already been covered. What is being discussed is the way damage is calculated for robots.


I kept seeing people refer to SNPS which is Supernatural PS.

The damage should be calculated as PS -15 plus the hand or weapon damage. How ever from various other sources suggest a higher damage. The group I am with adds the restrained damage from SNPS to the PS -15 add to hand/weapon for both Robotics and Super Human PS.

But with the example within the HU Core book in the robotics section the example is using a SHPS score of 100 ...not 66-85 that your math says it should be using.
With your math the 100 SHPS would work out to be 85 on the SNPS damage scale....and the SNPS damage scale doesn't go that high.

Now subtracting 30-49 points from the SHPS score does fit the basic premise you proposed. yes this will move the lower end off the SNPS damage chart for getting more damage then just punch damage of 1d4 for the damage variable.

EXPS and SHPS are not like SNPS, they are mainly just moving the mundane PS to higher scores. Not moving them to 'an order of magnitude' high that SNPS does.

Yes, people abbreviated things...like writing today's date out as 1-31-2020, instead of January thirty-first of the year two-thousand and twenty Anno Domini.
SNPS still reads as supernatural physical str. even if abbreviated.


HU2 page 294 clearly states that the Damage chart is added to the regular damage bonus. Thusly a SNPS of 100 would do 85+2d4x10+hand or weapon damage. How we have it a SHPS of 100 would do 85+5D6+hand or weapon damage
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

SpiritInterface wrote:
HU2 page 294 clearly states that the Damage chart is added to the regular damage bonus. Thusly a SNPS of 100 would do 85+2d4x10+hand or weapon damage. How we have it a SHPS of 100 would do 85+5D6+hand or weapon damage

The ps score 100 being talked about is the SHPS 100 found in the example brought up in the OP.
Not SNPS. *assigns critical reading homework*

The others were compairing how the 'Creative standard' differes from the stated standard for robotic str. That is is Super Human PS. And how the "Creative standard" sort of follows the SNPS table.

If the SHPS is taken strait from the mainbook/as writen in the power's text, a SHPS 100 would only do 1d4+85 SD for a Robotic PS punch. Which is (punch damage) + (SHPS 100 damage bonus).
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by SpiritInterface »

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:
SpiritInterface wrote:
HU2 page 294 clearly states that the Damage chart is added to the regular damage bonus. Thusly a SNPS of 100 would do 85+2d4x10+hand or weapon damage. How we have it a SHPS of 100 would do 85+5D6+hand or weapon damage

The ps score 100 being talked about is the SHPS 100 found in the example brought up in the OP.
Not SNPS. *assigns critical reading homework*

The others were compairing how the 'Creative standard' differes from the stated standard for robotic str. That is is Super Human PS. And how the "Creative standard" sort of follows the SNPS table.

If the SHPS is taken strait from the mainbook/as writen in the power's text, a SHPS 100 would only do 1d4+85 SD for a Robotic PS punch. Which is (punch damage) + (SHPS 100 damage bonus).


The problem is that they state that Robotic PS is the same as Super Human PS. Then the just make up different damages for each different Robots that have no consistency. I forget where but they limit normal PS to 24, Superhuman PS to 45. And other places the have put limits of 45-55 on Robots. So in the typical Palladium writing style, they leave it up to the GMs to define what the rules are.

Now for a mind break, is Cyborg PS, Robotic or normal?
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by Stone Gargoyle »

SpiritInterface wrote:
Now for a mind break, is Cyborg PS, Robotic or normal?
Cyborgs are Bionics category so they get Extraordinary PS.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

Excluding the score bonuses, the differences between normal PS, EXPS and SHPS are the life/carry limits.

With just the innitial die roll in HU a char can get a score of 30 to their normal PS. And that is not counting any PS bonuses from skills or powers.
...can=possible, even if unlikely...

If there are specific text limiting the PSs upper limits please post them. (remember to use the HU books for this.)
The limits that go along with nPS and the powers are: normal PS can't be below 3, EXPS can't be below 22, and SHPS can't be below 25. (SNPS can't be below 35.)
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by SpiritInterface »

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:Excluding the score bonuses, the differences between normal PS, EXPS and SHPS are the life/carry limits.

With just the innitial die roll in HU a char can get a score of 30 to their normal PS. And that is not counting any PS bonuses from skills or powers.
...can=possible, even if unlikely...

If there are specific text limiting the PSs upper limits please post them. (remember to use the HU books for this.)
The limits that go along with nPS and the powers are: normal PS can't be below 3, EXPS can't be below 22, and SHPS can't be below 25. (SNPS can't be below 35.)


Per HU2 page 16, Normal and Extraordinary PS has a top limit of 40, and page 204 limits Robot PS to 30 or twice the height of the Robot. SHPS and SNPS have no limits.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

HU RPG core book page 16, attributes beyon 30, physical str. 1st printing. wrote:A physical strength of 40 is the absolute P.S. limits for normal humans and humanoids, including aliens, mutants and mutant animals. See the suoer abilities Extraordinary P.S., Superhuman strength and supernatural strength for abilities that transcend the bounderies of ordinary humans.


PS score limit of 40 is only for normal PS.
The Robotic PS limit for 'human-like hands ans arms' was referenced in the OP.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

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drewkitty ~..~ wrote:
HU RPG core book page 16, attributes beyon 30, physical str. 1st printing. wrote:A physical strength of 40 is the absolute P.S. limits for normal humans and humanoids, including aliens, mutants and mutant animals. See the suoer abilities Extraordinary P.S., Superhuman strength and supernatural strength for abilities that transcend the bounderies of ordinary humans.


PS score limit of 40 is only for normal PS.
The Robotic PS limit for 'human-like hands ans arms' was referenced in the OP.


The the limit for the OP would be a 30 PS and a damage add of 15 sdc.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by 13eowulf »

SpiritInterface wrote:
drewkitty ~..~ wrote:
HU RPG core book page 16, attributes beyon 30, physical str. 1st printing. wrote:A physical strength of 40 is the absolute P.S. limits for normal humans and humanoids, including aliens, mutants and mutant animals. See the suoer abilities Extraordinary P.S., Superhuman strength and supernatural strength for abilities that transcend the bounderies of ordinary humans.


PS score limit of 40 is only for normal PS.
The Robotic PS limit for 'human-like hands ans arms' was referenced in the OP.


The the limit for the OP would be a 30 PS and a damage add of 15 sdc.


That is incorrect, and you may want to re-read what I posted. In particular the quoted section that is verbatim from the book.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by SpiritInterface »

13eowulf wrote:
SpiritInterface wrote:
drewkitty ~..~ wrote:
HU RPG core book page 16, attributes beyon 30, physical str. 1st printing. wrote:A physical strength of 40 is the absolute P.S. limits for normal humans and humanoids, including aliens, mutants and mutant animals. See the suoer abilities Extraordinary P.S., Superhuman strength and supernatural strength for abilities that transcend the bounderies of ordinary humans.


PS score limit of 40 is only for normal PS.
The Robotic PS limit for 'human-like hands ans arms' was referenced in the OP.


The the limit for the OP would be a 30 PS and a damage add of 15 sdc.


That is incorrect, and you may want to re-read what I posted. In particular the quoted section that is verbatim from the book.


Per drewkitty you were asking for human like hands (which to me means human sized), which are limited to 30 PS thusly 15 SDC Damage add. For robots larger than 15 feet the limit would be twice the height of the Robot which means a Damage add of PS -15 in SDC. this is per HU2 page 204 "The maximum Robot PS is 30 or twice the height of the Robot, whichever is greater." Since Robotic PS is the same as Superhuman and per HU2 page 236 Superhuman PS, and page 16 which gives a limit of 40 for PS and says that only Superhuman and Supernatural PS has no limit.

All PS classes except Supernatural PS do only PS -15 in additional damage. According to HU2.

Now the problem comes from the fact that they have created Robotic Characters that violates the rules as written.

Now the group I game with decided that Superhuman PS should be a class higher than Extraordinary PS, so we took the restrained punch damage bonus from the Superhuman PS chart and added it to Superhuman/Robotic PS, and it works for us.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

What I quoted was a verbatium...thus it was a quote. Not something I rattled off the top of my head.
--------
drewkitty ~..~ wrote:The Robotic PS limit for 'human-like hands and arms' was referenced in the OP.

This line is a 'statement'. If you don't understand why I would include the for 'human-like hands and arms' in my statement look up where the OP got his quote.
---------
SpiritInterface, you have a factual error in your post.
The str. score 40 limit is for normal PS...only. (see quoted text in last post)
If...I say ""IF""... your HU core book say something different Quote your book and say which printing it is.
----------
"...the Superhuman PS chart..." where is this. There is nothing like this in the 1st printing of the core book.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by SpiritInterface »

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:What I quoted was a verbatium...thus it was a quote. Not something I rattled off the top of my head.
--------
drewkitty ~..~ wrote:The Robotic PS limit for 'human-like hands and arms' was referenced in the OP.

This line is a 'statement'. If you don't understand why I would include the for 'human-like hands and arms' in my statement look up where the OP got his quote.
---------
SpiritInterface, you have a factual error in your post.
The str. score 40 limit is for normal PS...only. (see quoted text in last post)
If...I say ""IF""... your HU core book say something different Quote your book and say which printing it is.
----------
"...the Superhuman PS chart..." where is this. There is nothing like this in the 1st printing of the core book.


Heroes Unlimited page 2 "First Printing - March 1998"
Denotes verbatim text from the source cited.

I did quote HU2 page 16 under Physical Strength "A Physical Strength of 40 is the absolute P.S. limit for normal humans, and humanoids, including Aliens, Mutants, and Mutant Animals."
"Superhuman characters have no limits on their P.S. and can do amazing amounts of damage with their hands even damaging metal and stone structures"



What is the definition of "Superhuman"? Is Extraordinary Physical Strength, Superhuman? or is it Normal Physical Strength like it say it is on HU2 Page 231 "Extraordinary Physical Strength. This character possesses astounding physical strength. Although this strength is in the realm of human capability."
So which is it? Normal Humans, Humanoids, Aliens, Mutants, and Mutant Animals can't exceed 40 PS without getting the Power Superhuman Physical Strength or Supernatural Physical Strength or can they?


The take away is that all classes of Physical Strength (Normal, Extraordinary, Superhuman/Robotic), except Supernatural Physical Strength only do P.S. -15 as a damage add.

So robotic characters written in the books that have different damage adds other than P.S. -15, as a damage add are aberrations and should be ignored when building a character. full stop! end of discussion! per the rules as written on HU2 page 204 "Maximum Robot Physical Strength is 30 or twice its total height which-ever is greater. Also Robotic Physical Strength is considered Superhuman."


Supernatural Physical Strength damage chart on HU2 page 294 first column. I misspelled the word I meant, I am sorry.

================================================================================

As I wrote we felt that Superhuman/Robotic Physical Strength should be a class higher than extraordinary otherwise the only difference would be the carry/lift. With the damage add being P.S. -15 only. We also allow Physical Skills that add to Physical Strength to add to Supernatural Physical Strength as opposed to what it says on HU2 page 293 "Note that physical skills do not add to supernatural P.S., but certain super abilities may." Otherwise you would not get a Supernatural Physical Strength above 55 or so.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

SpiritInterface wrote:
Heroes Unlimited page 2 "First Printing - March 1998"
Denotes verbatim text from the source cited.

I did quote HU2 page 16 under Physical Strength "A Physical Strength of 40 is the absolute P.S. limit for normal humans, and humanoids, including Aliens, Mutants, and Mutant Animals."
"Superhuman characters have no limits on their P.S. and can do amazing amounts of damage with their hands even damaging metal and stone structures"

You skiped a line in the quote.
This one to be specific..."See the super abilities Extraordinary P.S., Superhuman strength and supernatural strength for abilities that transcend the bounderies of ordinary humans."
Notice that EX PS is listed as a super power that trancends the normal limits for humans?
This is the factual error I was talking about. The atributte score 40 for PS is only for normal 'human' PS.

-----------------
The robotic PS limits in the OP are that for the 'human-like arms and hands' that may be added to robots. If you do not understand then look at what section the OP quote is from.
Note: I am not disputing what the OP quoted. I am pulling more words from the text that defines what the OP quote is talking about, more specificly.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by SpiritInterface »

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:
SpiritInterface wrote:
Heroes Unlimited page 2 "First Printing - March 1998"
Denotes verbatim text from the source cited.

I did quote HU2 page 16 under Physical Strength "A Physical Strength of 40 is the absolute P.S. limit for normal humans, and humanoids, including Aliens, Mutants, and Mutant Animals."
"Superhuman characters have no limits on their P.S. and can do amazing amounts of damage with their hands even damaging metal and stone structures"

You skiped a line in the quote.
This one to be specific..."See the super abilities Extraordinary P.S., Superhuman strength and supernatural strength for abilities that transcend the bounderies of ordinary humans."
Notice that EX PS is listed as a super power that trancends the normal limits for humans?
This is the factual error I was talking about. The atributte score 40 for PS is only for normal 'human' PS.

-----------------
The robotic PS limits in the OP are that for the 'human-like arms and hands' that may be added to robots. If you do not understand then look at what section the OP quote is from.
Note: I am not disputing what the OP quoted. I am pulling more words from the text that defines what the OP quote is talking about, more specificly.


It transcends the normal 3D6 that Ordinary Humans get for Physical Strength. You ignored the quote where it clearly states that the power Extraordinary Physical Strength does not extend into Superhuman Category. HU2 page 231 "Extraordinary Physical Strength. This character possesses astounding physical strength. Although this strength is in the realm of human capability." and the quote that states clearly that only Superhumans can exceed the 40 Physical Limit, why else do they clearly state in HU2 on page 16 "Superhuman characters have no limits on their P.S. and can do amazing amounts of damage with their hands even damaging metal and stone structures"

I noticed that you ignored my question "What is the definition of "Superhuman"?" Does simply having powers make you "Superhuman"? If so then why do they specifically mention classes that get powers as having a limit? Or are you saying that Aliens, Mutants, and Mutant Animals are Ordinary?. Are you saying that a Batman like character who in the comic books clearly has Extraordinary Physical Strength is not limited to only have a maximum Physical Strength of 40?


As for the OP, I already addressed the fact that Robotic Physical Strength is limited to 30 or twice the height of the Robot which is clearly states in HU2 on page 204 "Maximum Robot Physical Strength is 30 or twice its total height which-ever is greater. Also Robotic Physical Strength is considered Superhuman." and that its damage add would be Physical Strength stat minus 15. They imply that the hand of a robot that is 50 feet tall does 2d4x10 in damage but do not support that anywhere else, they seem to imply that it uses the Supernatural Damage chart. With Palladium's poor editing it could be a typo.
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drewkitty ~..~
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

Chars with EXPS are included in the group called 'superhuman characters' in the text because they have a super str. ability. The word superhuman after they listed that super str, abilities as what breaks the 40 point limit is obviously being used to mean chars with super strength abilities.
And.....
Since they didn't phrased it like 'chars with SHPS and SNPS have no limits.....' they were not changing the specific list of super str. abilities that can exceed the 40 point limit for normal human PS.

Yes, the typical atribute score range is 3-18 (3d6), however, in HU2 the high end of the possible range is a score of 30 attribute points. There are at least two possible extra die rolls that can be triggered by high die rolls.
I am pointing this out because...Yes the EXPS point scores inhabit the same range as what can be typicly seen in strong normal humans. But EXPS is not normal human PS.
Your implication that EXPS is just normal PS with a higher point score, can be said of SHPS too.

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Spoiler:
The word 'superhuman' in the third paragraph dose not change the meaning or content of the specific list in the second paragraph of which super str. powers that transcend the boundaries of ordinary humans. This is because with each paragraph there is a change of idea being presented.

The idea being presented in the third paragraph is that chars with super str. abilities can do lots of damage, even damage to metal and stone.

Where the 2nd paragraph's idea is stating the limits of normal human PS and then states what transcend that limit.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by SpiritInterface »

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:Chars with EXPS are included in the group called 'superhuman characters' in the text because they have a super str. ability. The word superhuman after they listed that super str, abilities as what breaks the 40 point limit is obviously being used to mean chars with super strength abilities.
And.....
Since they didn't phrased it like 'chars with SHPS and SNPS have no limits.....' they were not changing the specific list of super str. abilities that can exceed the 40 point limit for normal human PS.

Yes, the typical atribute score range is 3-18 (3d6), however, in HU2 the high end of the possible range is a score of 30 attribute points. There are at least two possible extra die rolls that can be triggered by high die rolls.
I am pointing this out because...Yes the EXPS point scores inhabit the same range as what can be typicly seen in strong normal humans. But EXPS is not normal human PS.
Your implication that EXPS is just normal PS with a higher point score, can be said of SHPS too.

English Class
Spoiler:
The word 'superhuman' in the third paragraph dose not change the meaning or content of the specific list in the second paragraph of which super str. powers that transcend the boundaries of ordinary humans. This is because with each paragraph there is a change of idea being presented.

The idea being presented in the third paragraph is that chars with super str. abilities can do lots of damage, even damage to metal and stone.

Where the 2nd paragraph's idea is stating the limits of normal human PS and then states what transcend that limit.


Strange since my friend who teaches English says that because there is a specific power that is called Superhuman Physical Strength that the sentence "Superhuman characters have no limits on their P.S. and can do amazing amounts of damage with their hands even damaging metal and stone structures" means that that class or higher has no limit, especially since it is written in a category that only covers Physical Strength.

Further it clearly states that EXPS is the top end of ordinary strength hence the sentence "Extraordinary Physical Strength. This character possesses astounding physical strength. Although this strength is in the realm of human capability." And is not Superhuman. Superhuman Physical Strength is clearly beyond the realm of ordinary humans with a minimum of 35, and a maximum of 72, with an average of 48, before any physical skills. Whereas the top end of even EXPS is 48.

But hey you can interpret the whole section on Physical Strength your way, we have our own interpretation. Actually we still use HUr definition on Physical Strength which has no limits, including Robots.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

There is nothing it the powers' descriptive text in the PS powers, nor the over 30 PS text, that counters the specific list of powers that can exceed the 40 point normal human PS score limit that is presented in the over 30 PS text. I don't think we are going to agree about this.

P.S. EXPS is clearly beyond the realm of ordinary humans, because ""ordinary humans"" don't reach that level. Which is why it is called Extraordinary PS. Those with 'exceptional stats' are not ordinary ether. Even so, they are not in the catigory of being 'superhuman'.*shrugs*
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by SpiritInterface »

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:There is nothing it the powers' descriptive text in the PS powers, nor the over 30 PS text, that counters the specific list of powers that can exceed the 40 point normal human PS score limit that is presented in the over 30 PS text. I don't think we are going to agree about this.


There is nothing in the text that states that it can exceed the limit. Why put a limit of 40 on something that could not exceed 40 in the first place?

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:P.S. EXPS is clearly beyond the realm of ordinary humans, because ""ordinary humans"" don't reach that level. Which is why it is called Extraordinary PS. Those with 'exceptional stats' are not ordinary ether. Even so, they are not in the catigory of being 'superhuman'.*shrugs*


Then why does it state clearly that it is withing the realm of ordinary humans? "Extraordinary Physical Strength. This character possesses astounding physical strength. Although this strength is in the realm of human capability." It is implied that those with Extraordinary stats are Olympic level athletes.
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Re: Robotic P.S. in HU2

Unread post by drewkitty ~..~ »

SpiritInterface wrote:There is nothing in the text that states that it can exceed the limit.

I don't know if you misunderstand the text saying that all three PS super powers can exceed the 40 point PS score limit that is imposed on normal human PS,.....
HU RPG core book page 16, attributes beyon 30, physical str. 1st printing. wrote:A physical strength of 40 is the absolute P.S. limits for normal humans and humanoids, including aliens, mutants and mutant animals. See the super abilities Extraordinary P.S., Superhuman strength and supernatural strength for abilities that transcend the bounderies of ordinary humans.

The above quote of the core book is undeniable evidence that the house rules you are presenting are not the canon rules.

I know I am man enough to admit when I am wrong. And I have done it multiple times in these boards over the years.


EXPS tops out with itself at 32 by itself.
Adding in Skill bonuses it can be raised to 42 when using all the physical skills that give a PS bonus in the core book.
This is possible because the core book text SPECIFICLY SAYS IT CAN HAPPEN.

What you are doing is making iferences from 1) Text talking about what chars with super powers that give a PS bonus can do that normal human PS can't do, and 2) flavor text that doesn't say anything about limits. I've been told by others here (not in so many words): 'Flavor Text has ZERO VALUE when talking about ANYTHING RPG.'

Since you do not have any specific text that counters the specific inclution of EXPS of those super powers that can have a PS score greater then 40, I can not agree with you.

Standard Comment: Please stop pronouncing your house rules as canon.
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Each question should be give the canon answer 1st, then you can proclaim your house rules.
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